CL 19 is mostly done. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nInD9ybrpFq7cdzHBCML6hmqc5ujOwNJlUMshnI7HkU/edit?gid=1014622740#gid=1014622740
CL 20 will start in January as usual.
So let's sort out the important stuff.

First thing: templates.

Every clan who played last season is free to suggest their own. Preferably it's done by the clan contacts from last season, to avoid multiple submissions from the same clan.
What we need is a game link to a finished game on that template.
You can post them here or send me a WZ mail.
There's a limit of max 15 template submissions from a single clan, team and solo templates counted together, so that we don't get spammed by templates that nobody really cares about.
Note: it doesn't mean you need to submit 15 templates. You can send fewer.

The CL panel will then select templates from the ones all clans submit. While it's not exactly a vote, if the same template gets submitted by a lot of clans, its chances increase.
We will also try to continue the tradition and include one team and one solo template that has never been played in CL before, while avoiding templates played last season.
Only skill-based templates with low luck element will be considered. No lotto.

Deadline for submissions is June 14th

Feel free to check out this thread for inspiration: https://war.app/Forum/871115-cl-20-looking-templates
Or the Multi-Template Ladder list: https://www.warlight-mtl.com/all-templates

Second thing: feedback on rule changes for CL19.

A lot of things changed this season and while I didn't really hear any real complaints, I'm not sure if we created a proper channel for such feedback in the first place. And with the season mostly done I think now could be a good time.

So feel free to post here. Did you like or dislike the last changes? That is:
-reducing division sizes and fewer games
-reduction in banked boot time
-unlimited substitutions and abolishing rosters and midseason registration
-not fielding the same player on 3 team templates

Third thing: changes for CL20.

We don't really have any changes planned for next season, but maybe we should?
There was one idea that started gaining traction but was too last minute to be considered. And that was a straight 2-slots-per-person limit, at least for div A. Maybe B too. Not for C because because newcomers to CL don't need additional hurdles.

So what do you guys think about it? Do you perhaps have some other ideas in mind?

The purpose of this thread is discussion, so feel free to post your thoughts.

My two cents regarding past and proposed changes. I have been playing CL continously for the last ten seasons, so just consider this an old veteran's nostalgic rambling if you want.

Reducing division sizes and fewer games

Hard dislike. I always found the divisions to be too small, not too big, and another decrease to reduce duration of a season seems like the worst way to do it. I could imagine so much more fun with divisions made of 8-10 clans and 3 clans relegating each season.

I suggested this several seasons back once with detailed elaboration, but as there are only 3-4 elite clans left participating, this is even more true now. I see no reason to have CORP, TLA or MH die a boring last place every other season when we could have all these clans fight relegation every season

Reduction of banked boot times

Hard like, but insufficient. Reducing banked times further to a minimum which will satisfy most clans would allow to increase division sizes to a more appropriate number (more fun) and have the season run faster in general (more fun to watch and follow). This will also revive drama and discussion about CL, which has been stagnating at best for years.

Unlimited substitutions, no rosters

Perfect. Reduce bureaucracy and hurdles everywhere you can.

No three slotting on team templates

Probably good, don't feel strongly about this. Adults should be able to decide for themselves, but with negative examples in mind, probably better than the alternative. However, this is already somewhat addressed by unlimited subs.

2 slots limit for divs A and B

I don't think this is required. I played two 1v1 slots and one team slot this season and that seemed very relaxed, as 1v1 games can be played like any other games. People mostly have far more than this many games on their dashboards.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR ATTENTION TO THIS MATTER.

I would also like to reintroduce an idea I had put forward previously, inspired by various sports competitions (e. g. Fußball Bundesliga):

Have the 3rd last clan from division A play a promotion/relegation battle against the 3rd best clan from division B.

This could be done by matching all teams on all templates played that season between the finished season and the next (one extra game for every slot).

In my head, this would add a huge amount of fun and discussion material. Due to the low amount of games required, all games could be created manually and at the same time.

Wouldn't relegating 3 teams out of 8 be even more difficult for bottom clans than relegating 2 out of 6?

It would be a fight, as there would always be one "bottom clan" or two making it and more of them participating. Especially if you combine that with the promotion/relegation game idea.

The way it is right now, there is typically one sub-par clan dead last and the other relegation spot sometimes fought against. The way I suggest it, there would be several more clans around the level of the dead last clan, with one of them mostly surviving. It will also create more turnover of clans and increase motivation in B.

It's implicit in my idea that with current participation, there would be no division C.

I disagree with Alex (CONSEQUENCER) on this. I will come back to why later.

Folks, we have a serious problem. A very serious problem. Everybody knows it. The players won’t say it, but people are talking about it all over discord. They come up to me; Big clans, smart players, tough people, and they say, “Sir, what is happening with Alex?” And frankly? They’re right to ask.

Because Alex has been a disaster. Total disaster.

This guy goes on the forum, comments a lot, says all the politically correct things, and meanwhile, nothing gets done. Nothing! We’ve had discussions, committees, panels, such ethical panels, and somehow everything is worse. Incredible, really.

And Alex says, “I have a plan.” Have you heard this? Always a plan. There’s always a plan. But then you look closely, and there’s no plan! It’s just words. Empty words. Frankly, I’ve seen better planning from kids running lemonade stands. True story.

And the turtles love Alex. Of course they do. The lower divisions love him. Those lobbying for change love him. The people making money off failure love Alex. Why? Because Alex will never change anything. Never. He talks tough for five minutes and then folds immediately. Completely folds.

We don’t need that anymore, folks.

We need strength. We need confidence. We need somebody who walks into a room and actually knows how to improve Clan league. Alex couldn’t improve his situation in a diplo filled with bots, okay? He can’t do it.

And the commenters, very dishonest people, many of them, they keep saying, “Alex is doing great in the forum.” Which forum? Where are these posts coming from? I want to meet these people. Because everywhere I go, people are tired of Alex. They’re tired of excuses. They’re tired of weakness. They want results.

And I’ll tell you something else nobody wants to say: Alex has terrible energy. Low energy. Very low. We’re trying to build something incredible here, and this guy looks exhausted playing three 1v1s. It’s unbelievable.

Meanwhile, Masters is bringing in huge crowds. Thousands and thousands of people. The biggest crowds anyone’s ever seen in this league, by the way. The enthusiasm is through the roof. Because people know we’re going to win.

We’re going to rebuild things. We’re going to fix what Alex broke. We’re going to stop wasting time, stop apologising, stop being pushed around by people who don’t know what they’re doing.

And when we win, not if, when, people are going to look back and say, “Wow. That was the moment everything changed.” You watch.

Thank you everybody. Blowfly bless you. And believe me, the best is yet to come.

It's true, I am the best. I have now arrived though.

I started getting bored of your message part way through Min, then i realised I had to read it in a Trump voice. 10/10

fake news trying to smear masters good name...

There was a suggestion on Discord to allow multiple teams per clan.
This would be a substantial change so I'd like to hear more opinions on this.
I'm copy-pasting my own message from Discord:

1. We have this rule that on game creation you must be part of the clan you're representing.

This rule was created way back when we had a teamgame like NWO vs Wizards where none of the participating players were actually in either of these clans. The community generally agreed that it looked dumb and that's why this rule exists.

2. Harmony players are split among Harmony main and Harmony CW. Last season some players worked around that rule by jumping to Harmony main right before game creation and then back to Harmony CW. I think we can all agree that it's also dumb.

3. Allowing bigger clans to field multiple CL teams generally sounds like a good idea. After all, they are big because they recruit new players, turning random QM guys into community members and introducing them to strat/CL. That's what CL needs, instead of shrinking every year.

4. However, CLOT doesnt allow Harmony B or Harmony Trombones because clans like these don't exist.

With all this in mind, I personally think a good solution would be to allow joint teams.

So in case of Optimum for example, they could announce that Optimum and Optimum CW field a joint team. So people in any of these clans could play in CL without worrying about alts or clanhopping.

Harmony and Harmony CW could field 2 joint teams. They would need to decide which of these plays in A and which is the newcommer starting in the lowest division.

If TLA or some other clan wants to have a B team, they need to create a new clan, then they also can field 2 joint teams. That new clan could even be empty, from what I understand about CLOT.

Back in the day, SNinja could have fielded a joint team with ONE! instead of just merging into them and disappearing. That would've been cool. So this change would seem good for all the clans, small or big.

The idea of joint teams seems fairly harmless. Like you pointed out, clans being stretched thin wouldn't have to disappear (like SNinja, I wonder if Outlaws could have survived to some extent this way). You might need to determine how to proceed if the joint teams then split up and argue over a spot.

The concern with multiple teams from one clan always has been and always will be a fear that they'll end up in the same division and one will throw a critical game to the other. But if you think everyone became honorable after 20 CL seasons, I'll buy you a new clan called Pigs Fly and you can run as many teams as you want.

While I do not consider this one of the main problems that need to be addressed, I support the idea of joint teams and multiple teams per clan, as pointed out in previous discussions about this.

To me, this is another part of making things simpler and reducing the hurdles that stop people from participating in CL organized in the ways they want.

I like the idea of ​​having multiple teams within a single clan; it would allow more people to play if they aren't selected for Team A and take the pressure off their shoulders. It would also allow players who are more busy during the CL period to play in a less time-consuming division. For the problem Bonsai mentions, we could do something like in football (for example, in Spain, Real Madrid and Real Madrid Castilla), where Team B can't be promoted to the division where Team A plays, and if Team A is relegated to the division where Team B is, Team B would also be relegated.

I also really like the idea of ​​slashing the banked time, or even the boot time and making the CL faster, similar to the seasonal.

Edited 2026-06-09 11:25:10

My personal thoughts (not necessarily those of Harmony overall)

1. Clan League is Awesome

It has always been my favourite event and as such I am resistant to any massive changes.

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2. Division Sizes (aka Alex is a nob)

I found that a division of 6 was good. It achieved the goal of reducing the season length and relieving excessive pressure on key players with too many games. I have the opposite view to Alex on this. As I look down the league to 4th place and his Clan which was one spot from relegation, I can see why he is concerned. Those Turtles could end up strangled by the plastic six-pack rings and find themselves on a downward spiral if Division A is not beefed up to offer them some extra protection from relegation.

Whilst I am clearly mocking here, there is a serious point where I seem to differ from the elite players in Division A. On the one hand, there is some concern that if a top Clan were to relegate it may cause the Clan to die. People with this opinion also tend to think that Clans who struggle in Division A do not enjoy it and think that more Clans in Division A will alleviate this problem.

I take the exact opposite view. I think that it is a good thing that top Clans face serious jeopardy. This season big-hitters USB were relegated as a result of the rise of Harmony. Hopefully they will regroup and have a big push in Div B next season.

This has two benefits:

a) It means that there is occasionally a top Clan in Division B, giving Division B players the opportunity to play against top Clan; and
b) It means that the current top Clans are not ‘protected’ which allows other Clans to come through.

I think that it would be less good if we always know which two or three Clans will compete for the top spot and which will definitely relegate.

Harmony has been the surprise package in the past two seasons. I think that we should celebrate and encourage this rather than trying to prevent it. I don’t just think this because I play for Harmony - jeopardy and opportunity are two important features in my thoughts.

I would like to quickly dismiss the idea that the current system is cruel on the bottom placed Clan. I understand from d-c-o that despite suffering heavy losses, they really enjoyed it and celebrated hard with every point gained. That mood was similar in Harmony last season when we narrowly avoided relegation.

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3. Banked Times

I thought that the reduction this season worked well. I am not in favour of reducing this further and am especially concerned about reducing the boot times in team games.

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4. Unlimited Substitutions

Alex is correct on this, it was perfect.

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5. No 3-slotting on Teams

I am indifferent, although if 3-slotting is allowed I would prefer to be able to play 3 x team slots. Also, see 6. below.

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6. 2-slot Maximum (excl. Div A)

I would actually like to see this extended to the whole event. Currently, there are 18 slots, by three slotting this means that a minimum of 6 players is required. To my lights, this competition should be more of an overall reflection of the Clan than the best few players.

Harmony have benefitted from this in the past where Texx was carrying the Clan, but in truth our earlier success was so heavily reliant on Texx that it was not a true reflection of our overall skill as a Clan. Making a 2 slot maximum would mean a minimum 9 player roster which seems to do two good things:

a) it allows more players to participate from each Clan; and

b) it more accurately reflects the depth of skill in the Clan.

I think that this may be unnecessary in the lowest Division to allow new entrants.

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7. Play-off

I am VERY strongly against this idea, in either of the ways it has been presented:

A play off between a Clan due to be relegated and one due to be promoted has two issues:

a) it would extend the season when previous calls have been made to shorten it; and

b) it would create a difficult end to the season for a Clan who relegated from Div A to then lose a play-off

A play off for the top Clans to decide the overall winner also has two issues:

a) it would extend the season when previous calls have been made to shorten it; and

b) it would diminish the achievement of the Clan who won the current format.

An alternative has been suggested as 8. below.

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8. Further Competition

An alternative to having the top 2-3 Clans play-off, may be to have another top tier competition for those Clans AFTER Clan League. This could be Champions League ?

The format of this would need discussion but ideas like pick & ban and BO5 or whatever can be agreed in due course, but the principle of a further top tier competition in the second half of the year has some merit. I would not want to make it part of Clan League, the competition would be completely different.

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9. Multiple Teams / Mixed Clans

There are various ways this could work and in principle I am in favour of all of them. In a general sense, any change which is likely to increase participation without diminishing the quality of the event seems a no-brainer to me.

Sister Clans (e.g. Optimum / Optimum CW) should be allowed to count as one Clan. The CW Clans were only established as a result of a ‘Fizzer fix’ and are essentially just one Clan
Feeder Clans (e.g. Hawks / Nestlings) should be considered as separate Clans and should be subject to the provisions of c) below
Multiple teams per Clan (e.g. TLA A Team / TLA B Team) should be allowed. In the event that two or more teams from the same Clan are in one Division, they should play each other in the first round to minimise the risk of cheating (or even the perception of cheating)
One team from multiple Clans (e.g. HUNS & Kill ‘Em All submit one join team) should be allowed in the bottom Division only and there should be one lead Clan. Effectively, this means that any Clan in the lowest Division can use players from one other Clan (So KEA could have some HUNS players or vice versa).


There may be some technical reason to do with the CLOT (or whatever) which limits what can be achieved in this space but I think that this is the best change we could make to CL next season.

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Tl;dr version:

1. Alex is a nob
2. Don’t change too much about CL, it’s ace
3. Allow multiple teams from one Clan to participate
4. Do not play-off
5. Consider a further elite competition in the second half of the year
6. Alex was correct that unlimited substitution was a good thing but he is still a nob

Edited 2026-06-09 22:07:19

While Bodski and I disagree on a rather fundamental level what design features are desirable for an elite competition, he is like a War.app father to me and I love him dearly. Go Bodski!

I think one thing Bodski and the other people need to understand is that most people arguing that the league seasons should be shorter are arguing that because it was ridiculous 66 games were taking almost a full 6 months. It was incredibly frustrating that the league would take so long given that the game burden was not very high. Now that the league is getting faster and we’re still trying to push it to be faster still, it leads to the want to have extended play.

Fundamentally, I think the questions we’ve been posing is that:

Do RRs actually show us who the best clan is?

Is there other formats that would determine this?

Is there interest to move to those formats?

We have capability now to actually add to the league which we definitely didn’t before so I do think it’s time to start asking those questions since I do want this league to be the premiere league in deciding who the best clan actually is.

I don't think it's majority opinion that the game burden wasn't high. Especially when multislotting team templates.

4 months this time felt good